Lord Zarth asked about Taiwan:

It's well known Taiwan declares themself independent from Mainland China, and Mainland China declares that Taiwan is part of China. There's plenty of debate to keep the high politics and history experts talking forever.

From a more lower perspective, amongst my circle of friends and the Taiwanese I know, feelings are very warm. There's no language barrier - though Beijingers and Taiwanese will tease each other mercilessly about accent. We think their food is too salty, they think ours is too bland. We play basketball together and all support Yao Ming. It's a pain getting visas to visit each other (we must be the only country in the world that needs visa to visit your own country) and frustrating that there are still no direct flights from mainland to Beijing, but that makes Hong Kong airport very happy.

Some things that I think are great about Taiwan:

i) They have preserved historical Chinese culture much better than mainland. Their museums and art galleries are wonderful. They do a great job of reclaiming ancient treasures that have been taken overseas. And they do a better job of protecting historical sites. Mainland China has, at times, neglected the Great Wall (admittedly, it IS kind of long) or been slow to recover items from overseas.

ii) They still use the old (and much more poetic) Chinese written language. Mandarin has two forms of 'alphabet'. One of the things the Communist party did when it came to power was reform the alphabet so it could be more easily learned. The 'old' script would have sometimes over 15-20 strokes for one character. The 'modern' script has an average of 6. As an example, the Taiwanese character for 'flight' has a mother bird, carrying a baby bird over a bamboo bridge (about 14 strokes) . The mainland character for 'flight' has 4 squiggles. It's a lot easier to learn Mainland Chinese (would you rather learn 4 or 14 strokes?) but there is great beauty in the way the Taiwanese write.

iii) music, comics and computer games from Taiwan are more modern than in Mainland. Taiwan borrows heavily from US culture - they have pop starlets in mini skirts dancing sexy, or cool hip hop guys with ear-rings and necklaces. The big music stars are all from Taiwan. The sexiest models in FHM are often Taiwanese. Nightclubs play Taiwan jazz and rock and disco. Internet bars are filled with mainlanders playing Taiwanese MMRPG. The mainland one's are boring.

Similarly, there are many things the Taiwanese praise about Mainlanders - though I should perhaps let Taiwanese themselves talk about that. From a 'normal person' perspective, the hostility and politics about 'Taiwan is part of China' vs. 'Taiwan is independant from China' doesn't really come up so much. We seem to be so much a part of each other's lives, whether you want to call it independant or not, I'm glad for all the things that mainland and Taiwan share.

____________

Ubernaught and Ghostwes pointed out the issue of organ harvesting. I remember reading about this in the local press - and didn't realise there was so much about this in other news.

The way I read local news - greedy medical people plus some corrupt officials organised a scheme to get organ parts and sell them for profit. I remember there being rewards posted for information about them because the police were having trouble catch them.

The way I read the links that were supplied (thank you Ghostwes), there is a giant Chinese conspiracy to rip organs out of people and sell them for the profit of the Chinese government.

Frankly, I have very limited knowledge on this issue. My thoughts though are that in my experience, the government officials and public servants that I have contact would have trouble to organise a 4-person LAN party for Quake. To believe that a huge cosnpiracy and well-organised effort exists to doctors, hospital administrators, prison officials, Ministry of Health members all fully co-operate and hide to engage in a national organ harvesting attack is a bit hard.

I suspect that it is much more likely that there are insufficient checkings in place, poor booking, untrained administration and law enforcement people that are woefully lacking in resources - which means someone working in a prison or hospital or bureau somewhere has worked out a way to illegally make money. And I really very much hope they get caught.

God, now that I think of alot of stuff is happing to Asia. First that Cyclone in Burma (forgot Its current name), then the earthquake in China, and now I belive that there is the possiblity of another Cyclone. You think Burma would try to do more work to save there people, but then again the Junta probally thinks this is a good thing, less people, less problmes! I would watch for any major strikes from the people from Burma because of how the Junta dealt with the Cyclone.

One thing that should be noted about Taiwan is that there are two distinct peoples living there: the Chinese who fled from China during the revolution--mostly bureaucrats and their families, as I understand it--and an indigenous population, which were rather mercilessly repressed and displaced by the refugees. I've heard that there have been some recent attempts to restore some of the indigenous culture, but I'm not sure how effective it's been. Anyway, talking about Taiwanese "independence" from mainland China is kind of ironic, IMO.

Till May 15, 2008 8:00(GMT), the earthquake in Sichuan China, has killed 19'509, injured 102'103, and 12'323 still buried.
And China rescued 33 British, French, U.S. trapped tourists in the Wolong Nature Reserve by helicopter priority.

Just spent a fascinating 30 mins reading this lot - long time since I did that with a big thread ....

We all should be a little more careful in Blanket condemnation of a large group of people because of the actions of a few. Every Country in World has done, or is doing things it should not.

I live in UK, and no doubt our Colonial Cousins across the Pond will attest to some of our past activities, as will the Scottish re The Clearences    No one is a paragon of vertue.

When a Country is moving its 1.4Billion population from an Agricultural based economy, to a "modern" technological & industrial based economy, its going to get rough. Are there things that should not happen? Thats for sure. However I do believe the long term Objective is a genuine one, and I hope they stick at it.

Meanwhile, mightygoobi Sir, you are a remarkable individual. You have lead and steered (dont stop) a very eloquent discussion on a sensitive topic that could easily have degenerated into moronic yelling. I take my hat off to you, and if there are more like you around, China will eventually succeed in going down the difficult path of Change it is currently treading.

My one criticism? Stop apologising for posting dammit    I recognise the traditional chinese culture of humility showing through, however you have excellent English - damn sight better than my Chinese   

Regards
Zy

Every time I see this thread, I see this post and I can't help but reply to it (I've tried 3 times already, but kep doing stupid things that make me lose my text...


And a few with the US that bug me. Chief among them that some US citizns seem to have ben brainwashed in believing that they are better than everyone else...


Go study some American history. It's full of thngs as bad as Tiananmen Square.


*cough* Native American Indians *cough*


Yes. Did you know that there are nearly 4 times as many Chinese as there are Americans yet, China only just pollutes more than America. Yes. That means that on average, every American produces 4 times more pollution than every Chinese person.


*cough* Native American Indian *cough*. Again.


Double standard are not the sole Domain of the Chinese. Almost every country on the planet runs a fine set of double standards.


Talking about supporting corrupt governments... The US has exploited the governments of Iran, Irag, Afghanistan, Saudi Arabia, and most middle-eastern nations in order to get it's own way.


The US has sold weapons to dictatorships and corrupt governments for years. To influence governemnts and earn "a few extra bucks". How does this make the US better than China?


So too does the US.


Erm... right. The US's one (well actually 2) green efforts?
* Eventually admitting that they need to do something about the amount of pollution they produce.
* Putting polar bears on their endangered species list.

And the bad things? How about the following (all from the very recent past):
* Guantanamo Bay
* Abu Ghraib
* Extraordinary rendition
* Lying about WMD's in Iraq in order to give an excuse to invade
* Sanctioning torture (and before any one complains, convincing someone that they are drowning with waterboarding *is* torture)
* Despite agreeing they need to do something about their pollution, completely refusing to agree to do anything.
* Despite putting polar bears on their endangered list, saying that this will not stop the exploitation of the polar bears natural habitat.
* Police beatings, the latest of which was filmed and was only a couple of weeks ago.


And what about the milions of US citizens living substandard lives that everyone ignores and call "disenfranchised"...?


A lack of one does not cause the other. Using your example, what it does allow is drugs that would otherwise be too expensive to be used to save lives. Just look at Africa... The drugs produced by the big US pharmaceutical companies were being pushed in Africa, but no one could afford them. The result? Thousands of people died. THe use of cheaper alternatives has been going on for a while now and has saved a lot of lives. In fact, the big US pharms companies are now getting in on the act after they realised it can make them look good.


And I'm sure that is a gross over exageration. And I'm sure thaty they also have some very nice, law-abiding officials. Any government has corrupt officials in it (and this is what I hate most about politics - the liars, cheats and swindlers). Go and study some US political history. You might surprise yourself over how many corrupt officals that have been in it. I mean, even Hilary Clinton lied about landing under sniper fire when she didn't. hows that for honest?


That sounds very much like Capitalism, something which the US holds dear. And if you look at the people in power, you'll notice something.... They all know each other, they all went to the same universities and they're all well off, and their high level partners are also set up for life.... Sounds very much like what you describe for China...


And I'd like to see the US leaders living in the area that was hit by Hurrican Katrina in New Orleans, or in the scummy parts of Las Vegas, or in any of the areas in the US that are run-down and dirty. Oh wait, They don't do they? How's this for a double standard, asking the leaders of another country to something that the leaders of your country wouldn't do?


Exactly the same could be said of the US and it's poorest citizens.


Yes. All the Chines people I have met were very nice people. Thankfully I can also say the same about most of the Americans I've met, and most of the the other people I have met.

Damn there are a lot of arguments here!

Mightygoobi, you may be one of the few "Chinese Middle Class". These few live like the American Middle Class. You have to think from the perspective of some poor Chinese guy who got money revoked from him by the government. You have to think like the majority, not the minority.

And about the US and China's governments making people disappear: The CIA is supposed to look into other countries, not the one its in. While the CIA making people disappear is unacceptable is kinda defeats the whole "Land of the free" thing, you have remember that the reason they do it is because of George Bush. He's made the U.S. so paranoid after 9/11 that he could get away with doing something like that. As soon as he leaves office or gets asassinated by a person who hates him (one of 80% of Americans) things will change.

Okay, back to China.

Etrius

mad_axeman,
that was a bit confrontational and did nothing to answer the original questions. Woe upon us the day we must look to the USA to be the moral standard of the world. There is no need to compare everything to the USA nor any other country, but to objectively discuss the merits and flaws of the country in question.

There's certainly healthy and interesting political discussion here. Thank you for both the kind words and the strong criticisms. I won't fleeing the talk, and there is something more prioirity in my heart right now - obviously the earthquake - which I want to share some items a bit before we talk to Communism, Freedom, Human Rights, Government etc.

It's well known that Mainland China has disputes with Taiwan, Hong Kong and Japan at the high political level. From a 'common person' level, I am always so touched that every time we have a disaster, whether it is plane crash or train derail or earthquake or anything - it is Taiwan, Hong Kong and Japan that seem to always be the the first to arrive. We do not ask, they do not demand return - they just come, they give, they help and when it is over, they leave. Before we are even ready to accept help, they are waiting on the door with money, medical supplies, equipment, food etc.

Russia too is very regularly here and helping. I guess it probably helps that the older generation (who are often in high positions of power) speak better Russian than English or Japanese.

Singapore, often criticised for being a dictator, very regularly provides assistance. Of course it is small with much less resources, but it seems they are always helping and especially with technology and logistics and especially trained people. I guess they are fluent in both English and Mandarin that helps.

Just now, I understand the US is helping with providing satellite imagery to help find the earthquake victims. For that, even if you criticise China a million times for all the wrongs we do, I think we should be very grateful if we can even find just one more victim because of your satellite.

50,000 dead they are now saying. And probably much higher. It's so bad.

I will objectively discuss the merits and flaws of the country in question when other people do the same (which the poster I quoted was not doing). And I was no more confrontational than the poster I quoted.

As for original questions, he didn't have any. He had accusations and criticisms and however well founded, people shouldn't throw around accusations and criticisms without first checking that their own house is in order. And as for the questions of the first post - there aren't any as it's an open topic.

No country on earth really has it's house in order, you can always find a flaw with what is being done about something if you dig deep enough.

I think what really needs to used as the yard stick is the overall actions of a nation. as an Example, 1933-1945 Germany, Horrible history there, nothing redeaming during that time. 1945-1989 Both East and West Germany have good and bad points about themselves that can be pointed out 1989-present Germany has emerged as a weathervane concerning Human rights and international affairs...

so you could run around for years yelling about how alful the Germans are by constantly pointing out 1933-1945 and then highlighting only their mistakes after that. This would give a scwed view of the nations history in a very vary negitive way that would make some say "Why would anoyone support Germany about anything they say or do"

You could point out only 1989-present and have people writing sonnets about how wonderful Germany is..

You can do this for any country and the richer the history of that nation the more extremes you will find.

My case in point using America as an example.

Offical government policy United States: Give small pox infected blankets to the Native culture.. The result was a genoside that even Hitler commented about.

Official government policy United States: The Marshall Plan

Two extreams of conduct by the same government. So are we genosidal monsters or Godly saints of Pieity?

Pray tell... What exactly is "in order?" Do you have a static copy of the per civilization standard for qualifiying for an opinion? Or do you just adjust the parameters as the need arises?

To ProfCS101, you posted two very passionate comments which I want to respond. Because you wrote so strongly, I have tried to be very thorough in my reply to you.



If I may summarise the rest of your post, USA is good because it is free. China is bad because it has a dictator government and the citizens are oppressed, killed, tortured (although I am brainwashed into not knowing it) You hate the chinese government, and I am lying to defend it and all the Americans who believe are less intelligent than you.

With respect, your point of view is held not only by yourself, but by many of the internet. I've read similar thoughts on other forums. In this forum even I've read similar ideas. I see 'karma' points for "good reason for hating the Chinese government" and "hate the communist, damn communist". So I do not see you as a troll or a baiter but as someone making a strong and popular point.

You also made the time to not only put your thoughts once, but also reply to a post. Many times, I see "China sux!" and then the poster disappears. So I respect your consistency. Unsurprisingly, I am not agreeing with you - and disagreement can accompany respect for different views.

I understand you have a great pride for the United States. I think thats great - it is nice to see patriotism. From your writing is also a passionate hatred for China. What I don't understand is why 'love for America government' must also accompany to 'hatred for China government'.

So I'd like to explore the reasoning for your passion.



One possibility for passion is that China gives crap propaganda about America. You are welcome to read what China Ministry for Foreign Affairs, our media or simply talk to someone on a Chinese street about the US. Of course you will get a hundred different answers. But generally, I think they are very soft compared with other remarks I seen written about the US from other countries and even in here forum.

When the world was talking about Abu Grahib or Guantanamo Bay, China media was quite soft. I needed to read international media to find more and get more of the photos. As far as I know, we don't even have a Chinese word for "extraordinary rendition" but this word is used a lot in foreign press.

We read much about the positive side of Clinton, Obama and McCain - so much so that I think the are all excellent. It was hard to find any information in Chinese press about Clinton dodging sniper fire or Obama's priest.

Our young people eat American McDonalds, watch NBA. Our middle class want American cars. Our educated want to go to Harvard or Yale. Our Professors cite your supreme court. Our legislature models new laws on American legislation (our new company law with emphasis on directors duties and the fiduciary principle is taken directly from your laws). I personally respect American way of life even if it is different to my own.

So I'm not clear where there is the idea that 'China propaganda attacks US all the time'. Even today, we are thanking the US for the use of satellite to find earthquake victims and thanking America for the money donated for the earthquake.



One possibilty for your passion is that Americans fight and die for freedom, Chinese fight and die for dictatorship. Your two wiki links are to the American War of Independence from British and China's civil war between the Communist Party and the Nationalist Party.

My understanding of the American War of Independence is that US did not want to be taxed by Britain without representation in the British parliament. US wanted to keep the US money taxes for US politicians, rather than British politicians. I respect that this is a kind of freedom that US fought for, the freedom to spend your own money and make own decisions instead of giving it to another government.

The wiki on the Chinese Civil War is very long. I do not see the part which says "Chinese fight and die for dictatorship".

If I may provide an extra short and simplistic summary - two sides fought a Chinese civil war. One side had the label 'Communist'. The other side had the label 'Nationalist'. I use the word 'label' because the wiki does not explain fully what the two sides political beliefs are.

Each side felt they were doing what was right for China. Both sides did bad things to each other and caused lots of damage to the country. The side label Communist wins.

Perhaps you may argue that Communist policy was bad and Nationalist policy would have been better. And we can have that debate if you would like. But of course, rear view vision is always perfect.

Also, perhaps you may argue that Communist did very bad things to China after they won the civil war. I agree that Communist Party has done good and bad things and we could debate what is good and bad.

But I'm sorry that I do not agree with you that "Side with Communist label wins civil war" means "Chinese fight and die for dictatorship". So I do not understand how this can be the basis of "why do Americans hate Chinese".



I agree that Freedom is very important. I also think that it needs to be balanced on other things.

I believe that some american scholars says that even American Freedom is not absolute freedom. For example, you don't have Freedom to shout fire in the crowded theatre. A journalist can not say lynch Tiger Woods on a golf show. I can not bring a gun onto an airplane.

With respect to government, your own scholars also say that too much freedom is anarchy. There is freedom of speech, of action, of assembly but it is not infinite.

So there must be some line on freedom. To draw the line on where is the freedom appropriate is a very good question. Should I have freedom to burn an American flag in times square? Should I have freedom to say 'god damn america' in church? should I have freedom to riot outside the white house? These are all excellent questions to be debated.

But Freedom as a #1 Priority above everything else might be too far, isn't it? Otherwise, why not give you the freedom to shoot the president? or you to shoot me? Perhaps the better question is where to draw the line on freedom as a high priority but still give people the enough feeling of being free?

I would agree with you that America and China put the priority on individual freedom at different levels. I also don't think that just because we priority freedom at a different place makes one country better or worse than the other. Nor does putting the priority on freedom differently seem a reasonable reason to hate.



I understand your good quote comes from Mr. Henry talking about rising arms to fight against the British after Britain sends the ships to America to take back the colonies. It seems Mr. Henry spent almost 10 years, giving speeches, proposing legislation, using every political power he had to oppose British rule and tax. It seems it was only when the British ships were on the sea about to come in with cannons, did he give this speech that ends with the line you quoted.

The quote comes from a man who is pushed to the very edge, desperate having tried over and over and over again for tens years to get something done but his government stops him. And only when the government is about to bomb him with ships and cannons on his door, does he say "give me liberty or death".

If my government was on my door with ships and bombs and guns, I suppose I would be super angry and say something like "I don't care! Try and kill me but I will resist! Liberty or death!" as well. So I think his words are correct in his situation.

But, in my case, I don't think my government is going to bomb me. In fact, my life seems to be getting better. Since my life seems to thankfully be much better than Mr. Henry, I think our situations are not the same.







I think your point is China can't change the government by voting, but America can because it had the independant war. Although I pretend to complain, actually it is a 'fake' complaint and 'fake' freedom - actually I'm an obedient government robot. One day if I upset the government by going too far I will die. I am brainwashed with little commerical goods like TV and car and computer, but this is distracting from the power to change the government which is the real freedom to determine future.

Is the 'true' definition of 'freedom to determine my future' the ability to vote out the government? If that's the case, then it is true, we can not vote out our government so by this definition, we have not freedom to determine our future.

For me, if government can keep the street safe of crime, keep economy good, keep jobs available, rescue people when there are dying in an earthquake, then I feel I have enough freedom to determine my future. I feel no blockage in making money, finding a job, getting educated, donating money to charity causes, looking after my family, taking my girlfriend on a holiday overseas.

You say that I am brainwashed because of my "worthless crap" like computers and toys and sit at home eating rice. I understand the right to vote your government is a key issue for you. I guess that you are more interested in politics and government change that I. But just because I have a different idea to you, I don't think that makes me brainwashed or that I spend all day wondering in awe at my pretty rice bowl.

You have a desire for political activity. You "had the balls to FIGHT" for your government. Frankly, China has had so many many many civil wars, I hope the next one is not soon. If the government seems to be doing a decent job, well, I think the need to revolution is low. I guess if it is doing a very bad job, I may change my mind.

But as I've mentioned, since today is better than yesterday, I am hopeful tomorrow will be better than today. And I'm happy with the government continue with its things so I can continue with my things.

Though I can not change the government in the way you are used to through a voting election , I feel I can change the government actions in ways that are meaningful to me. I am not silly to think one letter to one Minister will completely change China tomorrow. But I do think that when I comment or blog or write a letter or make a phone call, in my own way, I am contributing to the change of the government. When 1 million Chinese comment on a topic, I do feel the government listens.

Therefore, I also don't think voting in an election is the only way to affect change in society or government.

I suppose I may be the tiny minority of Chinese special middle class that feels 'free'. Perhaps "real" Chinese population still lives in oppressed tortured fear with no chance to make any comment. They get kidnapped when they 'truly' complain and I am just a special exception.

So don't listen to my words because I am biased - I warmly invite you to come into our forums, read our blogs, visit our country and have a look. You can visit our University Centers on Human Rights. You can come to our Government Schools and audit the classes on - most classes are public.

Of course I can't guarantee what you will hear. I am guessing it is not 1.3 billion people uniformly saying 'China government is perfect' and looking in rice bowls playing with toys. I am guessing you might hear some complaining. You are welcome to see how the Chinese government is changing, reforming, down-sizing, upgrading. Some of the changes are good. Some of the changes I strongly disagree with. Others have comment and complain. And I am guessing that not all of the complaining people have been tortured or murdered.



My understanding is that Americans deeply value your right to vote and choose your national leaders.

Often I am reading about the need for 'voter turnout' - how many ordinary Americans come to vote. I understand that this year, there is exciting because voter turnout is very high.

I did a google and the first entry indicated that voter turnout in the 2008 Presidential Primaries seems to be 2.1 - 52.5%

http://elections.gmu.edu/Voter_Turnout_2008_Primaries.htm

And voter turnout in the 2006 General Elections seems to be 28 - 61%

http://elections.gmu.edu/Voter_Turnout_2006.htm

So, even at the high point, doesn't that mean that only 5 or 6 in every 10 people vote? Now, if people have the right to vote, but only let's say 6 actually do vote, I am not clear how this means "If Americans had no chance to vote and choose their leaders nationally, many would be in the streets in murderous revolt". I may be reading that table wrong and I welcome you pointing out where it is not accurate.

But even if there are 4 or 5 people in every 10 that do note vote, I presume all Americans would say that the government listens to them a little bit and at least partly considers their thoughts.

So by no means do I suggest that the right to vote is unimportant for you. Nor do I encourage taking it away. I simply stating that even if people do not vote, they still can have an impact on government.





I'm not clear exactly where the numbers come from - but for now I will accepting your figures. I am guessing you are referring to the period during which Chinese people died in famine under Chairman Mao. I agree it was a terrible time in Chinese history, many died, and I think there's little doubt that any policies leading to national famine are awful.

You may also be referring to the cultural revolution - something which Ooglyboogly very honestly spoke about with regarding his family. Again, I agree it was a terrible time - a time which wiped out a whole generation of intellect and again many died.

So it's important that we make sure those times are never revisited. One way I suppose, is to overthrow the government in a violent revolution. Another way is for the society to become more educated, more demanding of the government, have more and more pressure on the government in non-violent ways. I guess both ways have advantages and disadvantages. I would not agree that the ONLY way or the BEST way to stop history mistakes from coming back is to have "the balls to FIGHT" in a violent revolution.

_________

Concluding, one important point I'd stress is that it's important to me not to 'bash America', just as I think it's unproductive to 'bash China'. I recognise so many many things that America does well - as mentioned before, we copy, use and cite America regularly here in China. There is no doubt that America is THE superpower - and I'm not sure China even wants to challenge the title. Frankly, there are places in China right now with no running water. I don't think we are very close to 'superpower' status.

When ProfCS101 you come out with very strong passion as to why we should hate China, you'll understand that I come back with strong passion as to that hate seems difficult to understand.

I started this post query with the suggestion that I can love country A without hating country B. I think it is very obvious that I have a deep pride and love for China. And I have that pride and love whilst having no "hate" for US. I don't think there needs to be a competition as to "my country is better than yours". In fact, from an outsiders point of view, I suspect US is more comfortable to live than China. You are more developed, more richer etc.

But my love my China does not stem from the 'toys' or money or the government. China is my home. I have no intention to leave. I have no desire to compete with you. I want to stay here and make things better in my own smallest way. And I would like to debate on inconsistency between outside world comment and my real world.

I don't think China is perfect. Nor do I think America is perfect. We may have different views on 'freedom', on 'communist' and 'democracy', on 'rights'. And we can debate them. We SHOULD debate them. I understand that I have a lot to learn about the way you do things over there. China has a lot of things to change. And I respectfully suggest that there are things that China can teach and share as well as learn.

Welcome your reply.

Away from all this politics and earthquake sadness, some friends and I joked here in Beijing on '10 bad chinese tourist abilities' tonight over some drinks. I thought I could share them.

1. When the plane takes off, it is important to go to the toilet 20 seconds after the plane takes off while the seatbelt sign is still on.

2. On the plane, it is very important to bring as much luggage as you can. the plane likes it when you bring a huge suitcase on board. Other customers also are very happy to move their bag so that you can put your suitcase in a convenient position.

3. Once the plane lands, it is important to immediately turn on the mobile phone, stand up and take the luggage out of the overhead bin. This must be done while the plane is still driving. It is especially important to completely ignore the flight girl who tells you to sit down four times and wait for the plane to stop moving.

4. After spending 3 month salary on a plane ticket to go to an exotic foreign land for a magical adventure, the first place to go is Chinatown.

5. At the Chinatown restaurant, look at the menu, order food, and then complain loudly to everyone hearing that the food is too salty, bland, expensive, spicy compared to the food back home.

6. Every single Asian person can speak fluent Mandarin. It is right to get angry at the Korean-Japanese who was born in California and lived in America all their life, if they do not speak Mandarin.

7. Even if they can not speak Mandarin, it is okay, just speak louder. They will instantly understand.

8. Even if they still do not understand, just write down your message in Chinese characters and show them the piece of paper. This will make them understand.

9. All locals exist to give directions. They have no meaning except giving directions to Chinese tourists. It is best to ask the person who is speaking on their mobile phone just as they get into a taxi - these are the most helpful people.

10. the best way to respect a religious building or an ancient library is to talk as loudly as possible and use many camera flashes.

Hmm... it was a lot funnier when we were a bit drunk.

@ mightygoobi: you're right that 你不是唯一一个中国人

I moved to the States just as I was about to enter Chinese middle school (end of 6th grade I think), and I envy you're eloquence. Despite having studied here through the entire American education system, I don't think I can come close to your abilities in argument.

@ anyone out there bashing China for its "poor human rights record" or its "totalitarian" government "oppressing" the people, honestly, if you have not been to China, and the only source of China you hear is from Western media (especially from American conservative media like Fox), then I can 99% guarantee you that you do NOT have the full picture. How can you, when you have only heard from ONE side of the story?

Growing up in China (and mind you, this was at least ten years ago), I can with full honesty say that the only thing "Communist" about the Chinese government is just that, its form of government. Long gone are the days when the government issued ration tickets, when you get a job assigned to you, and when you held that job for life (an "iron rice bowl" as it was called). Now you can argue that my relative youth at the time had a naive worldview, and you might be right. But the fact remained, I was as uncertain as the millions of other Chinese students about my future, about where I was going to school, where I would end up working, how am I going to support my livelihood.

Even today, when I visit China, it would be an adventure to find signs of Communism in Everytown, China. There are no armed guards patrolling every street, there are no Big Brother-like posters of "Dear Leader," there are no police wearing CIA style earpieces listening for signs of popular discontent, handcuffs at the ready to arrest anyone who had the audacity to speak bad about the government. Instead, you see McDonald's, you hear Western songs, you see the fashionable teenagers, and you see everyday people going about their everyday lives.

Are there injustices by the Chinese government? Absolutely, just as there are for every other earthly government. Do we Chinese have the same level of political freedom as the Western democracies/republics? No, though we do have the power to effect change. I just wanted to clear up the fact that China is NOT the oppressive, Orwellian terror state so often believed by those who have never been there.

And on the "10 worst Chinese tourist habits" post above, I ROFLed when I read that.